Oops, I did it again, again.
July 18, 2013 9:13 PM
A few weeks ago I bought a beaten up Hammond M3 and Leslie. I was such a massive hit with both band and audience, I figured maybe there was something to this whole vintage keyboard thing. So today I made another stupid purchase.
I can't tell you how different it is to play a real Hammond/Leslie from the emulated/sampled version of the same thing. The real thing just sits perfectly in the live mix. You can't play a wrong note. It's vastly, radically different. So I figured maybe a Rhodes would be the same. And OMIGOD, it's even more intense. I've always found sampled Rhodes(es) to be polite and kinda soft rock-y. But the real thing, bloody hell, it's a beast. I think the guy who had it before me voiced it really well. He played the hell out of it (it still has boot marks on the keyboard) but it's the least polite piano I've ever played. Bark, bark, bark. We tried it through the Fender Twin, but it really came alive through the Roland JC55.
Just like the Hammond, it's vastly different from the emulated version. Probably more so.
It has quite an effect on both the player and the audience. When we played a gig with the M3 and Leslie, people were coming up and taking photos of it. And it does really feel and look different, sitting behind a pair of these beasts as opposed to having your knobbly knees sticking from under a Nord Electro or something.
posted by unSane (18 comments total)
2 users marked this as a favorite
I can't tell you how different it is to play a real Hammond/Leslie from the emulated/sampled version of the same thing. The real thing just sits perfectly in the live mix. You can't play a wrong note. It's vastly, radically different. So I figured maybe a Rhodes would be the same. And OMIGOD, it's even more intense. I've always found sampled Rhodes(es) to be polite and kinda soft rock-y. But the real thing, bloody hell, it's a beast. I think the guy who had it before me voiced it really well. He played the hell out of it (it still has boot marks on the keyboard) but it's the least polite piano I've ever played. Bark, bark, bark. We tried it through the Fender Twin, but it really came alive through the Roland JC55.
Just like the Hammond, it's vastly different from the emulated version. Probably more so.
It has quite an effect on both the player and the audience. When we played a gig with the M3 and Leslie, people were coming up and taking photos of it. And it does really feel and look different, sitting behind a pair of these beasts as opposed to having your knobbly knees sticking from under a Nord Electro or something.
Oh yeah, the first time I saw a Rhodes up-close and in-person--The Slackers, a pretty bitchin ska band--I couldn't help but think, "I need one." It was obvious just from seeing and hearing it on stage that it's alive in a way that samples (which I know from, believe you me) just aren't.
posted by uncleozzy at 5:26 AM on July 19, 2013
posted by uncleozzy at 5:26 AM on July 19, 2013
Well lucky, lucky you you fucking bastard.
They had the same one at Paul's Boutique in Kensington Market last week. Also a really cool Farfisa.
I can't properly express my jealousy over your seemingly endless abundance of disposable income and space to put all of this stuff.
posted by chococat at 2:43 PM on July 19, 2013
They had the same one at Paul's Boutique in Kensington Market last week. Also a really cool Farfisa.
I can't properly express my jealousy over your seemingly endless abundance of disposable income and space to put all of this stuff.
posted by chococat at 2:43 PM on July 19, 2013
Well, the disposable income part is mostly because I buy them dirt cheap, Choco or swap them for things. This one is a total beater... Tolex is in shreds, boot marks on keys, everything loose as hell, missing hardware, broken tines, you name it. But that's half the fun. Hang out on Kijiji every flippin' day waiting for one to come up at the right price and then drive hundreds of KMs to snaffle it up. That looper was new but I sacrificed a guitar through a bizarre daisy chain of deals to get it.
But I do love my Q hut, I will admit that. Everyone should have one.
posted by unSane at 3:13 PM on July 19, 2013
But I do love my Q hut, I will admit that. Everyone should have one.
posted by unSane at 3:13 PM on July 19, 2013
Then you are super lucky/skillful.
I find that even good deals aren't good deals anymore, with the required amount of repair involved, (which I am entirely incapable of performing). I constantly hunt the Sally Anns and yard sales of Gravenhurst when we're up there, hoping for someone to sell some treasure from their garage, clueless to it's true value; but in these days of eBay and Craigslist, everyone is so savvy.
There's this young guy in Gravenhurst who opened up a "vintage" guitar store in the old town movie theatre, and it's the most crappy of the crappiest thrift store-guitars and he's selling them for hundreds of dollars.
posted by chococat at 5:41 PM on July 19, 2013
I find that even good deals aren't good deals anymore, with the required amount of repair involved, (which I am entirely incapable of performing). I constantly hunt the Sally Anns and yard sales of Gravenhurst when we're up there, hoping for someone to sell some treasure from their garage, clueless to it's true value; but in these days of eBay and Craigslist, everyone is so savvy.
There's this young guy in Gravenhurst who opened up a "vintage" guitar store in the old town movie theatre, and it's the most crappy of the crappiest thrift store-guitars and he's selling them for hundreds of dollars.
posted by chococat at 5:41 PM on July 19, 2013
I used to be incapable of fixing anything, but I made myself learn and after a couple of successes I realized most of it is MUCH easier than it appears.
I find the *only* place to find cheap stuff is Kijiji, and even then you just have to camp out and use your spidey sense. Nine times out of ten people want much more for their stuff than it's worth, so new listings are a waste of time. Most times the things I find are at least a month old and I email the person asking if it's still available, and if it is and hasn't sold they're usually desperate to get rid of it. eBay and Craigslist and stores and junk shops are a total bust... I ignore them.
There's also this funny little community of people who buy and sell and trade instruments, and they are quite helpful and supportive. If they know you want X they will keep an eye out for it and then one day you will get an email about some old lady in who the fuck knows where who has just what you want. All they want is for you to return the favour.
One of the unexpected bonuses of doing this is that you meet a ton of interesting people.
posted by unSane at 6:42 PM on July 19, 2013
I find the *only* place to find cheap stuff is Kijiji, and even then you just have to camp out and use your spidey sense. Nine times out of ten people want much more for their stuff than it's worth, so new listings are a waste of time. Most times the things I find are at least a month old and I email the person asking if it's still available, and if it is and hasn't sold they're usually desperate to get rid of it. eBay and Craigslist and stores and junk shops are a total bust... I ignore them.
There's also this funny little community of people who buy and sell and trade instruments, and they are quite helpful and supportive. If they know you want X they will keep an eye out for it and then one day you will get an email about some old lady in who the fuck knows where who has just what you want. All they want is for you to return the favour.
One of the unexpected bonuses of doing this is that you meet a ton of interesting people.
posted by unSane at 6:42 PM on July 19, 2013
I've inherited my dad's skill of thinking I can fix something and then going all in, ignorant, only to completely fucking wreck it. I remember being like 10 years old zand hearing my dad break the shit out of something and yell "FUCKING BASTARD!" with all kinds of smashing noises, when he didn't know I was 5 feet away. He was like the king of that, still is.
I've found that I'm okay when I research something obsessively, and follow instructions...but the problem comes when you don't have the right tools or your situation deviates from the instructions. Recently I fixed my 12 string guitar, for about $15, when 2 local guitar shops quoted me between $100-300. I had to construct a jig and improvise clamps and everything, so I'm not a total idiot, I guess.
posted by chococat at 7:03 PM on July 19, 2013
I've found that I'm okay when I research something obsessively, and follow instructions...but the problem comes when you don't have the right tools or your situation deviates from the instructions. Recently I fixed my 12 string guitar, for about $15, when 2 local guitar shops quoted me between $100-300. I had to construct a jig and improvise clamps and everything, so I'm not a total idiot, I guess.
posted by chococat at 7:03 PM on July 19, 2013
I think the swearing is a big part of it. My dad skipped town when I was 11 and he wasn't big on, well, anything really, before that, so I never learned any of the usual skills and have had to acquire them, painfully, later. But there is something very empowering about losing that image you have of yourself as someone-who-can't-do-things. Now, quite wrongly, people assume I can fix things and bring them to me. And most of the time I can, because usually it's something incredibly simple like a loose wire. The one thing I can't do is any kind of detail work. I'm far too impatient for that. So I'm good with beaten up things that need to be put back into more-or-less working order. i have friends who do things like inlay carpentry or build acoustic guitars from scratch, and all I can say is fuck that shit.
posted by unSane at 7:41 PM on July 19, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by unSane at 7:41 PM on July 19, 2013 [1 favorite]
Also, I think Gravenhurst, they see you coming a mile off. The bargains are all in buttfuck places you've never heard of. Elmira, Maple Valley, Angus... or some scuzzy apartment building in Etobicoke... or even (according to our keyboard player anyway) some homeless person pushing a Leslie 760 down King St. in a shopping trolley.
posted by unSane at 8:11 PM on July 19, 2013
posted by unSane at 8:11 PM on July 19, 2013
We tried it through the Fender Twin, but it really came alive through the Roland JC55.
but have you tried putting emulated versions through amps? - i'm not saying the real thing wouldn't be better, but i think one has to try several possibilities to be sure
posted by pyramid termite at 1:39 PM on July 21, 2013
but have you tried putting emulated versions through amps? - i'm not saying the real thing wouldn't be better, but i think one has to try several possibilities to be sure
posted by pyramid termite at 1:39 PM on July 21, 2013
Yes, I've done that. I played a gig last year with a midi keyboard hooked up to my MacBook and one of the Rhodes emus, going through an amp and also DId to the PA. It sounded OK, nothing special. And my SV1 usually goes through the Jazz Chorus too. Again it sounds OK, pretty good actually, but again really just a shadow of the real one.
The best one I've come across is the Neo Soul Suitcase, which is absolutely terrific for recording and has bags of mojo, but to play it live it would need a Mac, some kind of host, a midi keyboard, and so on. By the time I've finished saying all that I've sort of lost the will to live.
posted by unSane at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2013
The best one I've come across is the Neo Soul Suitcase, which is absolutely terrific for recording and has bags of mojo, but to play it live it would need a Mac, some kind of host, a midi keyboard, and so on. By the time I've finished saying all that I've sort of lost the will to live.
posted by unSane at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2013
There are few things in life as satisfying as jamming on a real Rhodes. Someday I'll own one
*sigh*
posted by Doleful Creature at 11:44 AM on July 26, 2013
*sigh*
posted by Doleful Creature at 11:44 AM on July 26, 2013
I have a Rhodes on "indefinite loan" from a dear friend who I nevertheless would consider taking out a hit on if they decided to claim it back.
I strongly recommend putting some guitar pedals in the line to the amp. I've got distortion and delay, you can have some AWESOME fun with just those.
posted by greenish at 5:35 AM on August 2, 2013
I strongly recommend putting some guitar pedals in the line to the amp. I've got distortion and delay, you can have some AWESOME fun with just those.
posted by greenish at 5:35 AM on August 2, 2013
I finally got round to recording the Hammond and the Rhodes (and a live kit) here. There's also a link to the original version, which had samples, so you can hear the difference. The Rhodes is kind of submerged, but the Hammond is loud and proud.
posted by unSane at 1:52 PM on August 13, 2013
posted by unSane at 1:52 PM on August 13, 2013
Oh man, what a sweeeeet and badass tone. I should really try an actual organ/electric piano someday. The cheesy M-Audio I have is OK for hacking around in GarageBand, but there's no "there" there.
posted by usonian at 1:48 PM on August 14, 2013
...in these days of eBay and Craigslist, everyone is so savvy.Except for those people who try to sell beat to shit no-name piece of junk guitars and banjos for $200+ because "old instrument" must somehow equal "valuable"!
posted by usonian at 1:48 PM on August 14, 2013
i have an old rock that was beat upon by one of the original cavemen, kong - vintage tone for the ages, man
you can have it for 5k
posted by pyramid termite at 4:26 PM on August 14, 2013
you can have it for 5k
posted by pyramid termite at 4:26 PM on August 14, 2013
Our (somewhat new) keyboard player scored a Hammond A100 today (his second!) which is displacing the M3, along with a tube Leslie.
One of the slightly unexpected side effects of having these instruments is that it seems to make everyone in the band feel very happy.
posted by unSane at 7:54 PM on August 14, 2013
One of the slightly unexpected side effects of having these instruments is that it seems to make everyone in the band feel very happy.
posted by unSane at 7:54 PM on August 14, 2013
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yeah, this is similar to my experience as well. I liked the samples fine, but it turns out they are kinda like those "nylon guitar" synth presets - close to the tone of the original, sorta, but a radically different experience to play. A good friend of mine got a Rhodes not long ago, and we were playing together - hearing that thing through an amp and cab made me go "ohhhh". Some iconic gear really does deserve that status.
posted by dubold at 3:49 AM on July 19, 2013