Help a singer/guitarist be a one man band
February 7, 2009 6:38 AM
I'm a singer & guitarist who loves playing live, I usually play at open mic nights, but now and again I like to try and push myself to get out there and put together gigs of my own. One thing I find is once I get past playing about 6 songs, I am looking for a little more variation than just my voice and guitar.
I'm thinking either of playing backing tracks, or playing more instruments as I play the guitar. Does anyone already do this? What are the simplest things I could add to give myself more options? Are there tricks for keeping it my gig and not sounding like I'm tied to a backing track?
So far the two ways I think I can go (without adding musicians) are:
My initial thought is I would love to have some of the songs sound as big as the studio versions, but I don't want the gigs to become too robotic. Does anyone have experience of doing this? How would I play something on a keyboard with my feet? Could I keep the personal feel if I triggered MIDI samples? Could I sample myself playing real drums? Are there other ideas I haven't thought of?
This time I am also working out some clever ways to make some money for charity, mainly donations, auctioning off some of the songs I play that night, letting people donate to vote for what I play and also some clever way of making money off the beer that is sold on the night, but if anyone has any other great ideas on this, I'd love to hear them!
All ideas welcome, and if you find yourself in Edinburgh (Scotland) in April, let me know and you can see what happens! Or there may be a video...
posted by equality7-2521 (14 comments total)
2 users marked this as a favorite
So far the two ways I think I can go (without adding musicians) are:
- Add technology- play over backing samples & drum loops, do something with Reason live, or Ableton?
- Do more myself - sample some guitar then play over myself with a looper pedal, trigger midi samples with a foot pedal or something I can tap, play a pedal keyboard for some backing notes? or synth noises (like they do in Rush!)
My initial thought is I would love to have some of the songs sound as big as the studio versions, but I don't want the gigs to become too robotic. Does anyone have experience of doing this? How would I play something on a keyboard with my feet? Could I keep the personal feel if I triggered MIDI samples? Could I sample myself playing real drums? Are there other ideas I haven't thought of?
This time I am also working out some clever ways to make some money for charity, mainly donations, auctioning off some of the songs I play that night, letting people donate to vote for what I play and also some clever way of making money off the beer that is sold on the night, but if anyone has any other great ideas on this, I'd love to hear them!
All ideas welcome, and if you find yourself in Edinburgh (Scotland) in April, let me know and you can see what happens! Or there may be a video...
Hmm.
I've been in a few bands and also play solo shows with electric guitar/acoustic guitar/headrush e2 looper/delay/ehx smmh looper/delay/banjo/uke. I'm also a devoted fan of Andrew Bird, who formerly had a near-one-man show going on, as well as guys like Final Fantasy, Battles, etc, who use phrase sampling in depth.
For what you're going for, I'd just highly recommend collaborating with other people, even if it's a rotating cast of somewhat-practiced musicians. It's a whole lot of fun, and once you play with one person, a lot of times it's easier and more convenient to keep playing with more people in the same scene, etc.
On the other hand, having iPod backup is becoming pretty popular in a lot of indie rock bands, and it goes over well with audiences - but in almost all cases, the band is big enough that casual listeners don't think much about where that synth came from. But... with one person, I'm not sure if it would be a good effect. You know what the studio versions sound like, but the audience doesn't, and doesn't expect that out of a guy with a guitar. Also, it will definitely be somewhat robotic if you trigger in tracks that have a set pace.
You can also use a phrase sampler (I'd recommend the Headrush for its high audio quality and lack of quantization, which leads to robotic-sounding perfect rhythms), but it's not all that useful for traditional verse-chorus-verse-bridge-chorus song structures. You'll see that Andrew Bird, Final Fantasy, and Battles all have a crescendo-heavy building feeling in their songs which feature loops, and each usually have bits where they're building loops for use in the song. It's a whole lot of fun live, but you shouldn't expect it to pop right into an existing set of songs - I tend to write songs with loops, and then be able to adapt those for bands or for live w/loop performances, but playing them without the loop entirely is a serious change of composition, etc.
Note that phrase sampling is a delicate and somewhat nervewracking art. Playing a loop perfectly the first time is tricky, realizing you have a 1/16th note off in the loop after building it with 2 layers is very tricky.
If you can play keys well enough, that's an easy way to mix up your set - rewrite your songs on the keyboard and switch between. From your recordings, I think that your voice and a single instrument are plenty enough to make a good impression.
posted by tmcw at 2:21 PM on February 9, 2009
I've been in a few bands and also play solo shows with electric guitar/acoustic guitar/headrush e2 looper/delay/ehx smmh looper/delay/banjo/uke. I'm also a devoted fan of Andrew Bird, who formerly had a near-one-man show going on, as well as guys like Final Fantasy, Battles, etc, who use phrase sampling in depth.
For what you're going for, I'd just highly recommend collaborating with other people, even if it's a rotating cast of somewhat-practiced musicians. It's a whole lot of fun, and once you play with one person, a lot of times it's easier and more convenient to keep playing with more people in the same scene, etc.
On the other hand, having iPod backup is becoming pretty popular in a lot of indie rock bands, and it goes over well with audiences - but in almost all cases, the band is big enough that casual listeners don't think much about where that synth came from. But... with one person, I'm not sure if it would be a good effect. You know what the studio versions sound like, but the audience doesn't, and doesn't expect that out of a guy with a guitar. Also, it will definitely be somewhat robotic if you trigger in tracks that have a set pace.
You can also use a phrase sampler (I'd recommend the Headrush for its high audio quality and lack of quantization, which leads to robotic-sounding perfect rhythms), but it's not all that useful for traditional verse-chorus-verse-bridge-chorus song structures. You'll see that Andrew Bird, Final Fantasy, and Battles all have a crescendo-heavy building feeling in their songs which feature loops, and each usually have bits where they're building loops for use in the song. It's a whole lot of fun live, but you shouldn't expect it to pop right into an existing set of songs - I tend to write songs with loops, and then be able to adapt those for bands or for live w/loop performances, but playing them without the loop entirely is a serious change of composition, etc.
Note that phrase sampling is a delicate and somewhat nervewracking art. Playing a loop perfectly the first time is tricky, realizing you have a 1/16th note off in the loop after building it with 2 layers is very tricky.
If you can play keys well enough, that's an easy way to mix up your set - rewrite your songs on the keyboard and switch between. From your recordings, I think that your voice and a single instrument are plenty enough to make a good impression.
posted by tmcw at 2:21 PM on February 9, 2009
live looping via ableton or a self contained unit such as the roland/boss rc-50 is worth looking at, especially for cello.
look for videos from joseph arthur and zoe keating.
i use ableton live, which is the most righteous of live-looping solutions. but, i end up needing to bring 2 pc's to the gig, (if not more) cause shit happens. if you do go this route, it is helpful to dedicate a pc to the task (so that a random incoming email alert doesn't trigger during your performance).
i think that a small part of the audience may appreciate the now-ness of live-looping. some, however, are gonna get bored watching you operate a computer onstage.
with live, you can do almost everything with your feet (assuming a midi control interface, i use the behringer fcb1010). start/stop/record loops, trigger one-shot samples, etc. the rc-50 is pretty nice, there are 3 separate channels, volume on each is foot controllable. it also can store loops for 50 or so songs.
money-wise, times are tough. one idea i haven't really deployed yet is to have an area of the website password protected, with special content, and sell 'entry passes' at the show for a buck or two. please read up on the pluses and minuses of the '1,000 true fans' concept, it's great food for thought. and very saddening.
posted by kimyo at 9:13 PM on February 9, 2009
look for videos from joseph arthur and zoe keating.
i use ableton live, which is the most righteous of live-looping solutions. but, i end up needing to bring 2 pc's to the gig, (if not more) cause shit happens. if you do go this route, it is helpful to dedicate a pc to the task (so that a random incoming email alert doesn't trigger during your performance).
i think that a small part of the audience may appreciate the now-ness of live-looping. some, however, are gonna get bored watching you operate a computer onstage.
with live, you can do almost everything with your feet (assuming a midi control interface, i use the behringer fcb1010). start/stop/record loops, trigger one-shot samples, etc. the rc-50 is pretty nice, there are 3 separate channels, volume on each is foot controllable. it also can store loops for 50 or so songs.
money-wise, times are tough. one idea i haven't really deployed yet is to have an area of the website password protected, with special content, and sell 'entry passes' at the show for a buck or two. please read up on the pluses and minuses of the '1,000 true fans' concept, it's great food for thought. and very saddening.
posted by kimyo at 9:13 PM on February 9, 2009
I've been thinking of doing something smiliar. Myself to get back into music.
My current Idea is like Kimyo (not tried yet) is to use Ableton Live and a footswitch (the Behringer FCB1010 in fact). with basic preset basslines and very simple drums on Ableton.
but do live loop sampling of guitar and perhaps voice.
The issue I have is how do you sample the guitar?
- ie the usual Computer Line in / Line Out system does not sit well (transparently) between a Guitar and Amp? Do you sample the guitar through a DI? - do you sample with a Microphone the output of the Guitar Amp then run that to the PA when looping?
- Guitar pedal devices are all suited for guitar levels, and you can sit one 'transparently' between the guitar and Amp in a sense. - Laptop Computers are generally Not.
But are there any Phrase Sampling guitar Pedals that you can Midi Sync to Ableton?
posted by mary8nne at 8:11 AM on February 10, 2009
My current Idea is like Kimyo (not tried yet) is to use Ableton Live and a footswitch (the Behringer FCB1010 in fact). with basic preset basslines and very simple drums on Ableton.
but do live loop sampling of guitar and perhaps voice.
The issue I have is how do you sample the guitar?
- ie the usual Computer Line in / Line Out system does not sit well (transparently) between a Guitar and Amp? Do you sample the guitar through a DI? - do you sample with a Microphone the output of the Guitar Amp then run that to the PA when looping?
- Guitar pedal devices are all suited for guitar levels, and you can sit one 'transparently' between the guitar and Amp in a sense. - Laptop Computers are generally Not.
But are there any Phrase Sampling guitar Pedals that you can Midi Sync to Ableton?
posted by mary8nne at 8:11 AM on February 10, 2009
Oh wait the Boss RC-50 XL Loop Station has midi - but that thing looks liek a bgeast (ie it can probably replace the Computer..(hmm thats an idea)
posted by mary8nne at 8:16 AM on February 10, 2009
posted by mary8nne at 8:16 AM on February 10, 2009
@mary8anne:
I run both live guitar and loops to a single guitar amp. With the Headrush, you can send the loop to a different amp (you can't with a SMMH). Dedicated loopers like the JamMan, RC-20XL, RC-50 XL tend to have XLR inputs for a mic - you'd probably have an extra mic just for loops.
For sampling guitars/vocals with a laptop, you'd definitely use an external sound interface like M-Audio, MOTU, etc., make, rather than Line In/Out (as soon as audio gets even semi-serious, you don't want audio-digital conversion happening on your CPU)
If you're using Ableton, just live-loop the guitars using a midi foot controller rather than doing a completely different stack for guitar (that is if you're okay with vocals and guitar and drums running through the PA.)
posted by tmcw at 4:55 PM on February 10, 2009
I run both live guitar and loops to a single guitar amp. With the Headrush, you can send the loop to a different amp (you can't with a SMMH). Dedicated loopers like the JamMan, RC-20XL, RC-50 XL tend to have XLR inputs for a mic - you'd probably have an extra mic just for loops.
For sampling guitars/vocals with a laptop, you'd definitely use an external sound interface like M-Audio, MOTU, etc., make, rather than Line In/Out (as soon as audio gets even semi-serious, you don't want audio-digital conversion happening on your CPU)
If you're using Ableton, just live-loop the guitars using a midi foot controller rather than doing a completely different stack for guitar (that is if you're okay with vocals and guitar and drums running through the PA.)
posted by tmcw at 4:55 PM on February 10, 2009
@tmcw
do you mean you have your looped guitar parts + live guitar parts going through the Same Guitar Amp?
I'm thinking
1. Bass + Drums Loops --> House P.A.
2. Live vocals --> House P.A
3. Guitar -> Computer -> Amp then Mic if necessary - > P.A.
My issue is with the Guitar -> Computer -> Amp Chain.
I wasn't talking about using the built in Line In / Line Out on the Laptop - I have an RME Hammerfall MultiFace and this Little M-Audio Midi/Audio Keyboard thing
The problem is most sound-cards i'm aware of cannot output a signal of the right level to run straight into a Guitar Amp. There is just going to be a major mismatch in levels going via the computer.
posted by mary8nne at 3:20 AM on February 11, 2009
do you mean you have your looped guitar parts + live guitar parts going through the Same Guitar Amp?
I'm thinking
1. Bass + Drums Loops --> House P.A.
2. Live vocals --> House P.A
3. Guitar -> Computer -> Amp then Mic if necessary - > P.A.
My issue is with the Guitar -> Computer -> Amp Chain.
I wasn't talking about using the built in Line In / Line Out on the Laptop - I have an RME Hammerfall MultiFace and this Little M-Audio Midi/Audio Keyboard thing
The problem is most sound-cards i'm aware of cannot output a signal of the right level to run straight into a Guitar Amp. There is just going to be a major mismatch in levels going via the computer.
posted by mary8nne at 3:20 AM on February 11, 2009
um, rather than be coherent, i'm just going to ramble a bit, commenting on bits of the whole thread. apologies in advance.
if you don't already have a guitar amp, you might consider using a keyboard amp instead, you're likely want to mess with loops, for instance you might transpose a loop an octave down, in which case you'd be happier with the kb amp.
does you guitar amp have a recording output? that might serve as a source for the guitar signal.
also, you might just run everything into the house pa (first thru the hammerfall/pc), using in ear monitors (which are pretty crucial, imho, to onstage live-looping success).
i got to spend a bunch of time with an rc50, it's really quite sweet for looping guitar and vocals. plus, you can load it up with your own samples (something like 50 sets of 3 each)
the roland vg series is an amazing tool for live loopers, i use the banjo, the acoustics, the electrics, the basses, open tunings, all a single pedal press away. i have the vg88 and covet the 99. if there's a fire in the studio, the first thing i grab after the pc's is the vg-88.
you can do midi clock with ableton and the rc50, either one can be the boss.
i concede the beastly nature of the rc-50, but, it's one of those indestructible boss products, you could pretty much use it outdoors in the snow. as a snowboard. while you loop.
using a gate/limiter on the mic channel helps a lot with the livelooper's dilemma of house sound coming back into the loops and making everything muddy.
the best $140 i ever spent was for the behringer bcr-2000. amazingly useful for livelooping with ableton. dial up simultaneous multiple volume/delay changes in milliseconds (compared to mousing mousing mousing mousing).
if anyone is interested, i'd be glad to post some ableton sets i've developed for stage and studio livelooping.
i'm about to post an instrumental track called 'the siren of titan', have a listen if you'd like to hear the vg-88, all the guitar stuff in there was recorded with it.
this is me live-looping an instrumental version of the theme song from 'amelie':
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbNGM6q_SuQ
and this is my friend andrea, acapella, doing great justice to herbie hancock's watermelon man.
http://www.vimeo.com/11047
posted by kimyo at 4:41 AM on February 11, 2009
if you don't already have a guitar amp, you might consider using a keyboard amp instead, you're likely want to mess with loops, for instance you might transpose a loop an octave down, in which case you'd be happier with the kb amp.
does you guitar amp have a recording output? that might serve as a source for the guitar signal.
also, you might just run everything into the house pa (first thru the hammerfall/pc), using in ear monitors (which are pretty crucial, imho, to onstage live-looping success).
i got to spend a bunch of time with an rc50, it's really quite sweet for looping guitar and vocals. plus, you can load it up with your own samples (something like 50 sets of 3 each)
the roland vg series is an amazing tool for live loopers, i use the banjo, the acoustics, the electrics, the basses, open tunings, all a single pedal press away. i have the vg88 and covet the 99. if there's a fire in the studio, the first thing i grab after the pc's is the vg-88.
you can do midi clock with ableton and the rc50, either one can be the boss.
i concede the beastly nature of the rc-50, but, it's one of those indestructible boss products, you could pretty much use it outdoors in the snow. as a snowboard. while you loop.
using a gate/limiter on the mic channel helps a lot with the livelooper's dilemma of house sound coming back into the loops and making everything muddy.
the best $140 i ever spent was for the behringer bcr-2000. amazingly useful for livelooping with ableton. dial up simultaneous multiple volume/delay changes in milliseconds (compared to mousing mousing mousing mousing).
if anyone is interested, i'd be glad to post some ableton sets i've developed for stage and studio livelooping.
i'm about to post an instrumental track called 'the siren of titan', have a listen if you'd like to hear the vg-88, all the guitar stuff in there was recorded with it.
this is me live-looping an instrumental version of the theme song from 'amelie':
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbNGM6q_SuQ
and this is my friend andrea, acapella, doing great justice to herbie hancock's watermelon man.
http://www.vimeo.com/11047
posted by kimyo at 4:41 AM on February 11, 2009
oh, and -
equality - nice work on 'take a chance'. if you want things to come in and out while you play (loops follow you, instead of vice versa), you'll definitely need in ear monitors, and a great sense of rhythm.
mary8nne - you could also split off the guitar signal using a tuner/efx pedal, one output to the amp and the other to the hammerfall. you'd lose the characteristics of the amp in your loops, but live has plenty of options there.
posted by kimyo at 5:04 AM on February 11, 2009
equality - nice work on 'take a chance'. if you want things to come in and out while you play (loops follow you, instead of vice versa), you'll definitely need in ear monitors, and a great sense of rhythm.
mary8nne - you could also split off the guitar signal using a tuner/efx pedal, one output to the amp and the other to the hammerfall. you'd lose the characteristics of the amp in your loops, but live has plenty of options there.
posted by kimyo at 5:04 AM on February 11, 2009
I want to run the hammerfall back into the guitar Amp though?
posted by mary8nne at 5:42 AM on February 11, 2009
posted by mary8nne at 5:42 AM on February 11, 2009
I think I would need one of these: http://www.reamp.com/history.html
$199USD (+ S&H)
except that it has a balanced XLR input. argh
posted by mary8nne at 5:59 AM on February 11, 2009
$199USD (+ S&H)
except that it has a balanced XLR input. argh
posted by mary8nne at 5:59 AM on February 11, 2009
why not run the hammerfall output through the house pa? or, are you going for an 'all in one package'?
some boss effects have a line in (for 'jam-along'), you might use that to feed the hammerfall back in to the amp.
this should allow you to run your computer sound out into the guitar amp:
http://www.fullcompass.com/product/302763.html
you could end up with noise problems though, especially in venues with fluorescent lighting.
posted by kimyo at 6:06 AM on February 11, 2009
some boss effects have a line in (for 'jam-along'), you might use that to feed the hammerfall back in to the amp.
this should allow you to run your computer sound out into the guitar amp:
http://www.fullcompass.com/product/302763.html
you could end up with noise problems though, especially in venues with fluorescent lighting.
posted by kimyo at 6:06 AM on February 11, 2009
I'd prefer to have the looped guitar to be still comign out the guitar amp so that ti 'sounds the same' as if I was playing it live.
ie so people don't suspect that it is a pre-recorded bit.
posted by mary8nne at 6:39 AM on February 11, 2009
ie so people don't suspect that it is a pre-recorded bit.
posted by mary8nne at 6:39 AM on February 11, 2009
I know people who use looping pedal a lot, Iona Marshall, Lipsync for a Lullaby (see Myspace). My friend plays a kick-ass one-man show with a cello and a looping pedal. Both have formed bands eventually and necessarily, but they went through the looping pedal phase and still use it for small gigs, at open mics... I was thinking if you keep making contacts with the people you meet at open mics, you'll find opportunities, either to learn to play in a band or to get your own stuff played... good luck!
posted by yoHighness at 6:10 PM on February 28, 2009
posted by yoHighness at 6:10 PM on February 28, 2009
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posted by Karlos the Jackal at 5:16 PM on February 8, 2009